在肖恩“吹牛老爹”库姆斯的审判中，经过三周的证词过程，有一个人已经浮出水面，尽管他仍被关在2500多英里外的监狱里。那个人是马里恩“苏格”奈特，被许多人看好的说唱音乐经理作为库姆斯的主要竞争对手库姆斯在嘻哈世界的巅峰时期。
在本周末与美国广播公司新闻(ABC News)的数小时谈话中，奈特提供了他对这起审判的反应，这起审判占据了头条新闻，并提供了一幅经常令人不安的流行文化偶像和时尚引领者私生活的画像，如果罪名成立，他可能最终被判在联邦监狱度过余生。库姆斯不认罪，否认所有不当行为。
到目前为止，奈特的名字在库姆斯的审判中至少被提到了50次，其中一些涉及到臭名昭著的库姆斯-奈特竞争，其他人只是承认奈特曾经领导过库姆斯的激烈竞争对手死囚唱片公司。他们的名字是嘻哈音乐爆发的代名词，也是两大巨头之间的嫌隙和他们的唱片公司的代名词。
奈特在周六的一系列电话采访中为自己辩护，他描述了他所看到的嘻哈行业某些领域中的有毒滥用文化，这肯定不是从库姆斯开始的。
奈特目前因2015年的一起致命肇事逃逸案而被判故意杀人罪，服刑28年，与库姆斯的案件无关，他在2018年对该案没有提出抗辩。这位著名的死囚唱片公司创始人有一份广泛的犯罪记录，这增加了他目前的刑期，因为它触发了加州的三振出局法。据执法部门称，奈特与洛杉矶臭名昭著的街头黑帮有着长期的联系。
奈特在电话中说，如果库姆斯是说唱界唯一一个被指控暴力和虐待的人，这不会打破循环。
“如果你要做出夸张的回答，让每个人都回答，”奈特说，他指的是那些从以性好处换取晋升的系统中受益的人，或者是那些促成库姆斯被指控的那种行为的人。
“改变嘻哈文化问题的主题，”奈特说，他反复提到库姆斯早期的街名“噗噗”和“噗噗”
“我认为让帕菲说出他的真相是一件好事。说出真相，让每个人都负起责任，”奈特说。
早在联邦当局指控库姆斯涉嫌性交易和敲诈勒索与所谓的强迫性行为“怪胎”有关之前，奈特就声称早在20世纪90年代和21世纪初就有关于库姆斯性生活的传言。
“每个人都知道这一点，”奈特说，但“膨胀不只是在行业内流行，并说'嘿，我想和每个人都发生性关系，'”奈特说。“我的意思是，我们没有足够的时间来说出所有的名字。”
库姆斯涉嫌使用恐惧和暴力来获得他想要的东西，这是他的刑事案件中经常出现的主题，远远超出了性的好处。对库姆斯的起诉取决于核心指控，即库姆斯使用胁迫和武力来获得他想要的东西。为了证明这一点，检察官提出了库姆斯的前助理摩羯·克拉克，她说她在离开库姆斯的工作岗位后回到库姆斯工作，因为库姆斯据称使她不可能在音乐行业的其他地方工作。
“他掌握着与我有关的所有权力，”克拉克抽泣着作证说。
克拉克告诉陪审员，她在库姆斯之前曾为奈特工作，她声称库姆斯不喜欢这种关系。
“他告诉我，他不知道我和苏格·奈特有任何关系，如果发生什么事情，他会杀了我，”克拉克作证说。
在反诘问中，库姆斯的辩护律师马克·阿格尼菲洛试图破坏克拉克对库姆斯的整体描述，以及她为什么要继续为一个据称曾威胁过她的人工作。
“我想要回我的生活，先生，”克拉克解释道。
“你想和他再次合作，”阿格尼菲洛说。“我想在音乐行业工作，”克拉克回答道。
在他对美国广播公司新闻的评论中，奈特哀叹克拉克据称受到的待遇。
“我为摩羯座感到难过，”奈特说，描述“一个想要努力工作并在世界上取得成功的年轻女性。”
“她为帕菲做了很多事。他需要什么，她都有。他想要的任何东西，如果她没有，她都会实现，”奈特说。“很多人可能会说，摩羯可以做任何她想做的事情。她尽力了。如果你去环球影业找工作，而帕菲打了个电话，你就得不到那份工作。如果你去柜台代理公司或电影行业找工作，然后帕夫打了那个电话，你的职业生涯就结束了。”
奈特回忆说，克拉克告诉他，另一位唱片公司高管警告她不要“告发帕菲”，据称她因保持沉默而获得了报酬。
在证人席上，克拉克回忆起一次会议，她声称，她得到了这样的警告。
“这不是工作机会的问题。他们在那里告诉我不要管帕夫，我不会有好下场，”克拉克作证说。“那次会议的结果是——嗯，没有工作，但这是一个警告。”
作为对证词的回应，奈特说:“他们把那个女人置于一种境地，如果她想进入这个行业，她别无选择，只能努力对这些人保持冷静。”
奈特说，库姆斯并没有发明他声称使用的强硬战术。
“不要误解我，他(库姆斯)做了可怕的事情，但他只是没有自己想出那些东西和那些想法，”奈特说。“我觉得他们不应该把帕菲带走，把他锁起来，扔掉钥匙。我认为他现在可以做很多好事，他说出了这个行业的真相，”奈特说。“当你可以挑挑拣拣把谁送上火坑的时候，这不公平。”
库姆斯应该说出“全部真相，只有真相，上帝保佑他。那样的话，每个人都会——历史不会不断重演，”奈特说。“这个行业中有一长串的人因为他们所经历的事情而不开心。这就是令人难过的地方。”
奈特说，他同情库姆斯的立场。
奈特说:“我觉得在帕菲的生活中，在他成长的旅途中，人们辜负了他。”
“我认为他犯了一些错误吗?我认为他在重复他所看到的。他重复他所学到的，”奈特说。
“我要告诉帕菲的第一件事是——我不会经历他正在经历的怪异经历。但我一直坐在那些牢房里。我知道他觉得他在这个世界上没有朋友，”奈特说。所有那些曾经在他迷人的轨道上的人，“没有一个上过法庭。没有一个是有用的。所以我很确定他现在很孤独，”奈特说。
库姆斯的家人一直陪在他身边，有些人甚至旁听了审判过程;奈特指出，这对他的孩子来说尤其不容易。
“如果有一种情况，他可以做一些时间，但不是很多时间，去敲出来。不要一直折磨自己，”奈特说。“一旦他到了他要去的地方，到了一个真正的监狱，他就能，你知道，离自由更近了一步。”
奈特建议，也许库姆斯应该认罪。(奈特本人对故意杀人罪没有抗辩，于2018年被判入狱。)在上个月审判前夕，库姆斯拒绝了认罪协议。
“我认为他们应该和帕菲达成协议，”奈特说。
尽管库姆斯和奈特通常被媒体和执法机构描绘成竞争对手，奈特说他有不同的看法。
“我不会说我们是竞争对手，因为说我们是竞争对手意味着我们必须是非常非常糟糕的敌人，”奈特说。
“我确实觉得他关心音乐产业。我认为他确实热爱这个行业，他和他的艺术家们做得很好，我和我的艺术家们做得非常好，”奈特说，详细介绍了嘻哈音乐从街头音乐到十亿美元业务的漫长竞争历史。“我经常这么说，帕菲以制作热门单曲而闻名，比如《一首歌让你疯狂》。我以制作热门专辑而闻名。帕菲可以带着一个艺术家一起创作伟大的音乐。我可以让一个艺术家成为超级巨星。”
库姆斯和奈特之间所谓的恩怨是库姆斯审判早期证词的焦点。库姆斯的前私人助理大卫·詹姆斯说，2008年的一个晚上，他看到奈特和他的随从在好莱坞梅尔的免下车餐馆吃饭，并说库姆斯听到后，想去面对奈特和竞争对手。
奈特这样回应证词:
“如果有任何事情表明我在做任何非法的事情，我会说，绝对没有，”奈特笑着说。“我是这样跟你说的——我敢肯定我记得一些。”
“任何认识我的人——从凌晨2点或3点，到将近早上6点，我总是和六七个(漂亮的女人)在梅尔酒吧尽情享受。直到我最终和一个人在一起，”奈特说。“我是一个真正的西海岸人，我喜欢吃不同的东西，但梅尔餐厅是我的地方之一，因为，梅尔餐厅是24小时营业的，你知道吗?”
如果库姆斯真的坚持要回到餐馆去和奈特对质，正如詹姆斯所作证的那样，奈特说，也许是因为“他必须展示他的力量。”
关于两个唱片公司老板之间的竞争，奈特说他被告知库姆斯会听死囚的音乐。
“我对此感到惊讶，”奈特说，他指的是已故的死囚牢说唱明星图派克·夏库尔。“他会放死囚音乐，他会放Tupac，他们会去码头的船上，游艇上，不管是什么，让死囚音乐再次响起。”
“我希望他没有嫉妒我，因为如果他嫉妒我，那意味着他太喜欢我了，太爱我了，”奈特说。
奈特说:“我没有把自己放在他的脑袋里，也没有放在其他人的脑袋里，因为这个人正在为自己的生命而战斗。”
Suge Knight speaks out about Sean 'Diddy' Combs sex trafficking case
Through the course of three weeks of testimony in the trial of Sean "Diddy" Combs, one man has loomed large even as he remains locked up in a prison, more than 2,500 miles away. That man is Marion "Suge" Knight, the rap impresario who was viewed by manyas Combs' chief competitorat the peak of Combs' prominence atop the hip-hop world.
During hours of conversation with ABC News this weekend, Knight offered his reactions to the trial that has grabbed headlines and offered an often-disturbing portrait of the private life of a pop-culture icon and fashion tastemaker who could end up being sentenced to serve the rest of his life in federal prison, if convicted. Combs has pleaded not guilty and denied all wrongdoing.
Knight's name has been mentioned in the Combs trial at least 50 times so far, with some of those references connected to the notorious Combs-Knight rivalry and others simply acknowledging that Knight once led Combs' fierce competitor, Death Row Records. Their names are synonymous with the explosion of hip-hop, and the bad blood between the two moguls, and their record labels.
Speaking for himself in a series of phone interviews Saturday, Knight described what he saw as a toxic culture of abuse in some parts of the hip-hop industry that certainly did not start with Combs.
Knight is currently serving a 28-year sentence for voluntary manslaughter stemming from a 2015 fatal hit-and-run not connected to Combs' case, to which he pleaded no contest in 2018. The famed founder of Death Row Records had an extensive criminal rap sheet that added time to his current sentence because it triggered California's three strikes law. According to law enforcement, Knight has longstanding ties to LA's infamous Bloods street gang.
On the phone, Knight said that, if Combs is the only one held accountable for alleged violence and abuse inside the world of rap, it won't break the cycle.
"If you're going to make Puffy answer, make everyone answer," Knight said, referring to those who benefited from a system of trading sexual favors for advancement, or enabled the kind of behavior of which Combs is accused.
"Change the theme of the culture of the problems in hip-hop," Knight said, repeatedly referring to Combs by his earlier street names "Puff" and "Puffy."
"I think it'd be a great thing to let Puffy tell his truth. Tell the real truth, and bring everybody accountable," Knight said.
Long before federal authorities charged Combs for alleged sex-trafficking and racketeering in connection with a lifestyle of allegedly forced sex sessions called "freak-offs," Knight claimed there had long been rumors about Combs' sex life back to the 1990s and 2000s.
"Everybody knew that," Knight said, but that "Puffy didn't just pop in the industry and say 'hey, I want to have sex with everybody,'" Knight said. "I mean, we don't have enough time to name all the names."
Combs' alleged use of fear and force to get what he wanted has been a frequent theme in his criminal case, far beyond sexual favors. The prosecution of Combs hinges on the core accusation that Combs used coercion and force to get what he wanted. To make that point, prosecutors presented Combs' former assistant, Capricorn Clark, who said she returned to work for Combs after leaving his employment because Combs allegedly made it impossible for her to work elsewhere in the music industry.
"He held all the power as it related to me," Clark testified through sobs.
Clark told jurors she had worked for Knight before Combs – a connection that, she claimed, did not sit well with Combs.
"He told me he didn't know that I had anything to do with Suge Knight and, if anything happened, he would have to kill me," Clark testified.
On cross-examination, Combs' defense attorney Marc Agnifilo attempted to undermine Clark's overall portrayal of Combs — and why she would want to continue working for a man who had allegedly threatened her.
"I wanted my life back, sir," Clark explained.
"You want to work with him again," Agnifilo said. "I wanted to work in the music industry," Clark replied.
In his comments to ABC News, Knight lamented how Clark had allegedly been treated.
"I feel bad for Capricorn," Knight said, describing "a young woman who want to work hard and become successful in the world."
"She did great things for Puffy. Anything he needed, she got it. Anything he wanted, if she didn't have it, she made it happen," Knight said. "A lot of people might say, well, Capricorn could have did anything else she wanted to do. She did try. If you go get a job at Universal and Puffy makes a phone call, you're not getting that job. If you go get a job at a counter agency or in the movie business and Puff make that call, your career is over."
Knight recalled Clark telling him she had been warned by another records executive not to "tell on Puffy," and that she was allegedly paid for her silence, he said.
On the witness stand, Clark recalled one meeting where, she claimed, she was given such a warning.
"It wasn't about job opportunities. They were there to tell me to leave Puff alone and that this wasn't going to end well for me," Clark testified. "The outcome of that meeting was that -- well, no job, but it was a warning."
In response to that testimony, Knight said "They put that woman in a situation where she didn't have no choice but try to be cool with these people if she's gonna be in the industry."
Knight said Combs did not invent the hardball tactics he allegedly employed.
"Don't get me wrong, he (Combs) did terrible things, but he just didn't come up with those stuff and those ideas on his own," Knight said. "I don't feel that they should take Puffy and lock him up and throw away the key. I think he can do so much good right now, him telling the truth about the industry," Knight said. "When you can pick and choose who to put on the fire pit, it's not fair."
Combs should tell "the whole truth, nothing but the truth so help him god. That way, everybody would – history won't keep repeating itself," Knight said. "It's a long list of people in the industry that's unhappy because of the things they were being put through. And that's the sad part about it."
Knight said he sympathizes with Combs' position.
"I feel that people in Puffy's life, going on his journey growing up, they failed him," Knight said.
"Do I think he made some mistakes? I think he repeats what he's seen. He repeats what he learnt," Knight said.
"First thing I would tell Puffy is this – I'm not going through what he's going through for his freak-offs. But I've been there sitting in those cells. And I know he feels that he don't have a friend in the world," Knight said. Of all those once in his glamorous orbit, "none have been to court. None of them have been a help. So I'm quite sure he's in a lonely place right now," Knight said.
Combs' family has remained by his side, some even sitting in on trial proceedings; Knight noted that cannot be easy for his kids especially.
"If there's a situation where he can do some time, but not a lot of time, go knock it out. Don't keep torturing yourself," Knight said. "Once he get where he going, to a real prison, he'll be able to, you know, have a step closer to freedom."
Knight suggested that, perhaps, Combs should plead out. (Knight himself pleaded no contest to voluntary manslaughter and was sentenced to prison in 2018.) Combs declined a plea deal on the eve of trial last month.
"I think they should work out a deal with Puffy," Knight said.
Though Combs and Knight are usually portrayed by the media and law enforcement as having been rivals, Knight said he saw it differently.
"I wouldn't quite say we was rivals, because to say we rivals that means we had to be really really bad enemies," Knight said.
"I do feel that he cared about the music industry. I think he do love the industry, and he did a great job with his artists, I do an incredible job with my artists," Knight said, detailing a long history of competition as hip-hop went from being a street sound to a billion-dollar business. "I say it all the time, Puffy is known for making hit singles, like one song to go crazy. I'm known for making hit albums. Puffy can take an artist and make great music with them. I can take an artist and make them a superstar."
The alleged grudge between Combs and Knight was a focus of early testimony in Combs' trial. Combs' former personal assistant, David James, said that, one night in 2008, he spotted Knight and his entourage eating at Mel's Drive-in diner in Hollywood, and said Combs, upon hearing that, wanted to go confront Knight and the rival group.
Knight responded to that testimony this way:
"If there's anything suggesting that I was doing anything illegal, I'm gonna say, definitely not," Knight said chuckling. "I'm'a put it to you like this -- I'm quite sure I remember some of that."
"Anybody that know me — from 2 o'clock in the morning or 3 o'clock in the morning, to almost 6 o'clock in the morning, I'm always at Mel's with six or seven [pretty women] enjoying myself. Until I finally was in a relationship with someone," Knight said. "I'm a real West Coast man, and I have different stuff that I like to eat, but Mel's was one of my places, because, Mel's was open 24 hours, you know?"
If Combs did insist on returning to the diner to confront Knight, as James testified, Knight said perhaps it's because "he's got to show power."
Of the competition between the two record-label bosses, Knight said he was told Combs would listen to Death Row music.
"I was surprised about that," Knight said, making a reference to the late Death Row rap star Tupac Shakur. "He'd put on Death Row music, he'd put on Tupac, they'd go to the boat in the marina, the yacht, whatever it was, and get the Death Row music going again."
"I hope he wasn't jealous of me, 'cause if he was jealous of me, that means he was liking me too much, loving me too much," Knight said.
"I don't put myself in his head – or no one else's head – because the man is on trial fighting for his life," Knight said.
